Game of Thrones Open letter : Baelish and spilling your guts

[alexandral]

I re-watched the episode 7 yesterday, so that I can get my weekly Game of Thrones episode to keep the momentum of obsession going. I have also discussed it with everyone and anyone who is willing to listen. Did I mention that I am largely succeeding in pushing the show and the books to my working colleagues? And what a good episode this was again! But I must rant say few things:

Dear Creators!

I really like the character of Baelish as played by Aiden Gillen. I never expected to be amused by this character so much. But what is it with making him into some kind of show creators' pet? What is it with giving other character's stories (yes, I am still harping about the Hound's story) to Baelish and what is it with the gratuitous brothel sex scenes, inexplicably crossed with his heart-felt confessions to the brothel whores? I never liked teachers' pets and I am on the verge of feeling dislike for Baelish.

On the storytelling level, I feel (I might be wrong here), this scene didn't fit with Littlefinger's character. He seems like a person that does not disclose anything unless this serves his interests. And here he is spilling his guts and his secrets to the Northern whore who has some intimate connections to several men from the North and who potentially can spill his secrets to these Northern men?

As a logic and science geek, I also want to mention that no-one travels as fast as Ros-the-whore did from Winterfell to King's Landing, not without an airplane. Is Roz going to be revealed as a secret Targaryen heir, with a dragon stashed somewhere in secret place? Is she going to be the Queen of Westros one day? There must be something important for Ros's character in the future episodes, otherwise I don't understand why we see so much of her.

To finish, the scene was nausea-inducing and it lasted far too long. It felt like "it's not for girls" culture that I abhor. Please stop it. I know you want your ratings high, and I want your ratings high too because many of my favourite events will be happening in the season 3. I want your season 3 almost as much as you do, but still, this was bad.

PS: I want to show off my new "devious Baelish" icon.

Spoilers : No book spoilers so far

Comments

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

My friends and I named Rose the exposition whore. All the characters where they didn't know how to introduce their background now fuck rose and spill their guts. It feels quite superfluous and I wish they'd believe enough in the stories that are told to let them stand in the room without a naked girl.

Also it makes me wonder about the actual sexscenes from the book. They are never superfluous or gratifying. They get something on, yet so far non of those was really there. I wonder if we're going to see that much naked Tyrion as we see of the naked whores, or if body fascism is going to prevent that.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I think you are right - for some reason this is the chosen exposition vessel.

I can't complain about other sexscenes in the show as well (other than one's involving Ros, these were all very relevant.

The answer could lie in Ros' character description on GoT website (found when I Googled to try to find out what her name is spelled):

"The character is not from the books, although there are a number of prostitutes in the novel's King's Landing whose name she could have been given. She could represent any one of the unnamed prostitutes mentioned in King’s Landing, however. " - basically instead of several whore characters the show creators had a bright idea to have ONE (which is all these other whores at once, which is a strange multi-personality concept :D)

[baleanoptera.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I agree. That scene was OOC and just too much. Also, your point about Roz telling the men from the North his secrets is a good one.

There must be something important for Roz's character in the future episodes

I stand by my suspicion that they are going to give her Shae's storyline. Or maybe I'm just hoping they will give her something to do other than being naked...

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I think you are right, but I really hope you are wrong. For one thing, "Shae is eighteen, short, and very pretty, with large dark eyes and black hair." and Ros is none of these.

I found this on the GoT website about Ros: "The character is not from the books, although there are a number of prostitutes in the novel's King's Landing whose name she could have been given. She could represent any one of the unnamed prostitutes mentioned in King’s Landing, however. "

She is all-in-one-whore , so to speak.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

It seems Shae is going to be a different actress: http://ohnotheydidnt.livejournal.com/49424522.html

[baleanoptera.livejournal.com]

That's actually good news. :) Though Roz is then still a character without any real narrative purpose other than being naked.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I really quite liked what I saw of the actress who played Shae (she is also getting some acting award in germany or something like this).

This is what the show's wbesite says about Ros:

"The character is not from the books, although there are a number of prostitutes in the novel's King's Landing whose name she could have been given. She could represent any one of the unnamed prostitutes mentioned in King’s Landing, however."

She is all prostitutes, rolled in one. Who would hvae thought this is a good idea?

[baleanoptera.livejournal.com]

Who would hvae thought this is a good idea?

Particularly since it involved her traveling to King's Landing ect. It just breaks with the narrative probability.

To be honest I wouldn't mind as much if she had something other to do than being naked, but when her role seems pretty much limited to that it's annoying.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

To be honest I wouldn't mind as much if she had something other to do than being naked, but when her role seems pretty much limited to that it's annoying.

Yes, she is definitely just an exposition device. ** sigh **

[intermezzo]

Still not watching this, but Aiden Gillen? Is fantastic!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

He is so awesome and absolutely nails his role , but I am so put off by one scene in the last episode.

[lydzi.livejournal.com]

Apparently Shae is listed with another actress name so hopefully, we'll have another person than Rose.

IA about the scene. Too much. Too noisy and preps to Gillen to still have me hooked on what he was saying despite the all too disturbing girls having a go in front of my eyes.

I'm not really understanding what's the deal with Rose tbh. I mean yeah I get the fact that they are making her somehow the "voice of the People" (see the last scene with Theon) but she's definitely too present. She has more lines than Robb Stark or even Sansa. Which is crazy.

And she definitely has more screentime than all of the direwolves combined.

Oh I love that icon of Baelish! I use it too because it's so vibrant, you can almost feel it's alive XD.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Oh, thank you! This is a relief, I was quite fond of all that story with Shae.

They did say that Ros is sort of representation of ALL whores. Aso, you see - if there were 4 or 5 or 10 nameless girls in the story, she is ALL of them in one.

But I have a feeling they are trying to be too clever and have her as a connecting character or something of the sort. Which is way odd.

[roboticduck.livejournal.com]

Good work on getting the coworkers into the show :D

My initial thought on the brothel scene was, didn't we get told this story already? But that was the book-reading clouding the earlier brief mention of the scar between him and Cat. You're right, I didn't even think of Roz's North connection, that would be very careless of Littlefinger!

The show hasn't established time very well, how much passes in an episode and in between episodes, and then having certain travelers cover ground in the span of a scene. Confusing.

I need a GoT icon !!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

hee! When I get seriously obsessed I can't shut up.

The full reveal of Baelish's past with Cat I think (I am sure) happens much later in the story. At the point of the episode 7 we are supposed to wonder where Littlefinger's allegiances are, I think. But I am not really that much against the early reveal (I had to give up trying to compare everything to the book some weeks ago), but I am against the reveal because it does not make much sense for Baelish to reveal his secrets to some stranger from the North.

I have made lots of GoT icons recently, if you like any of them: http://alexandral.livejournal.com/349050.html#cutid1

[roboticduck.livejournal.com]

My strategy re: the books was actually not doing a recent reread, so a few things in the show are like I am seeing them anew, and then some random details are like glaringly different, haha!

OHMYGOODNESS. Such shiny, colorful and pretty icons!!! I should probably upgrade my account, because I seriously want half of those O_O Thank you for linking!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Did you do a recent re-rerad? I am thinking about doing the same when ths how is over and I start getting the withdrawal symptoms. :D

YAY! I am glad you liked!

[roboticduck.livejournal.com]

No recent reread for me, but I am pretty sure I'll go through a withdrawal with no more show, so I def plan on brushing up on the books.

icons: I love Tyrion and Ayra so much, but I had to go with this icon because the expression is priceless :D Thank you!!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

It is so hard because I LOVE so many characters in this show. For example, Syrio is so fabulous!

[nymeri.livejournal.com]

While it might not be a secret per se, since I assume there were witnesses to the duel and the aftermath and gossip goes around... it's still too personal. It's one thing for a story to be spread from a third part source, but for Petyr to willingly bring it up like that himself seems so OOC.
Also, with everything going on at court, does he have time to give whores private lessons?

Imo they should have switched the telling of his and Sandor's backstories. Let the Hound speak for himself, and someone else about Littlefinger. Cut the sex scene, and there'd still be screentime left for Petyr. What were they thinking? :/

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Well, I seem to remember Baelish elaborating on how much he hates Ned and Ned's brother and how much everything he does is influenced by that hate, which was something that didn't seem to be known to anyone. In fact Cat seemed to think him as a "friend ". It probably fitted better to have this hateto be spilled slightly later, but I am not too worried here.

Hee! That is a good idea

hehehehehe! I like this idea!

[nymeri.livejournal.com]

Well, while I think the story is well known, Petyr's feelings wouldn't be. A man who lives on manipulating others wouldn't carelessly open up to others. At least he told his story (seemingly) casually. For now, his feelings about the matter should be up to the viewer to interpret.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Yes, it is not as if he was spelling it "I plan my evil plans against Ned". Oh, poor Ned, he is in a pit of snakes.

[nymeri.livejournal.com]

Evil plans or not, I think that he was torn and that he would be willing to cooperate with Ned for Cat's (and his own) sake. He gave Ned a chance, that he didn't take. At least that's how I see it.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I must have already asked but forgotten - where are you in the books? I will not spoil

I have always been distrustful of Littlefinger's intentions, for one - the story with the dagger is very fishy, it always seemed like one of those things in the crime shows that doesn't add up. I think he cooperates with his own intentions only, but this is my view.

[nymeri.livejournal.com]

I've read them all, but at the moment I'm rereading CoK. If I get something wrong, it's probably because my memory of the following books is somewhat foggy. There's so many details...

Never trust Littlefinger, yes. ;) But if Ned was willing to take the throne and cooperate with (or rather depend on) Littlefinger, I think he'd benefit more from that. Though I don't doubt he wouldn't hesitate to sacrifice Ned, if need be.
Still, he had most certainly guessed Ned's answer before he asked, but he is one to plan for all eventualities.

The dagger business -is- fishy though. Might be it was only a way to win Ned and Cat's trust, though, knowing GRRM, there could be more to it than that.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I intend to re-read the books after the show finishes.

But if Ned was willing to take the throne and cooperate with (or rather depend on) Littlefinger, I think he'd benefit more from that.

I don't know, I thought this would have been another disastrous move for Ned. Renly (and support of Tyrells) was actually the most sensible and most "noble" option. ** sigh **

[shapinglight]

I agree. Have just watched the ep this evening and that scene was pointless, boring and rather offensive. Which is a pity, because otherwise it was a very good episode.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I loved everything about the scene between Jaime and Tywin. This was so spot-on, it gave me goosebumps.

[shapinglight]

Not having read the books, I couldn't say, but it was a very good scene. Charles Dance was just wonderful.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

This scene wasn't in the books, but I thought it fitted perfectly

[earenwe.livejournal.com]

Oh, frustration. LJ just ate my long comment. I'm just going to say that I found this scene completely OOC for Littlefinger who would sooner move to Winterfell than offer that much information about himself willingly. I give Gillen credit though because as much as the girls were having a go I was transfixed on him, his voice and what he was saying. He really is a perfect Petyr.

I don't even have an issue with it having been a sex scene, just that it was too prolonged a block of time that could have been spilt up with a discussion about someone else as well.

Here's for hoping they don't have Ros be Shae as well. She's too important to Tyrion's story for that.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I am so sorry! I often edit my comments in other editors (or at least copy before posting so that I caan paste back).

I love Aiden Gillen - I would have never expected myself to give more than passing glance to Baelish, The power of good acting!

It just the scene seemed so unnecessary and so long?

As lydzi said in her comment above, shae is going to be cast as a different person ** sigh of relief **. By the look of it, Sibel Kekilli who is lovely : http://ohnotheydidnt.livejournal.com/49424522.html

[earenwe.livejournal.com]

It's not your fault, no worries! I usually copy it too - it's just the times I don't I have an issue, of course. :)

Long scene was indeed long. And hurrah that Shae is going to be an individual. The actress looks interesting, I'm curious to see what she'll look like when done as Shae. Thanks for sharing!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Long scene was indeed long. And hurrah that Shae is going to be an individual. The actress looks interesting, I'm curious to see what she'll look like when done as Shae.

She seems to have a lovely smile, with a hint of innocence in it.

[bond-girl.livejournal.com]

You're right, it was extremely OOC for Petyr to pour his heart out to a complete stranger!

My biggest problem with the girls scene is its length. I get it, they want to give some naked skin to viewers who have the attention span of a goldfish - while the major plot is being hammered into those who don't. However, the neverending moaning was ~fucking distracting *said in Christian Bale's voice :)*. The only valuable thing I learned from that scene was that Roz likes to be in charge.

That said, Roz's welcome has worn out with me! I associate her with Theon and everything about him makes my skin crawl, even in the most unspoilery way. I hope she has a major role to play; otherwise I'd be sore.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

As one of my friedn said , even True Blood does not have such lengthy scenes of pointless sex. :D

Theon - I so join in Theon hate. But to tell the truth, I had a twinge of pity and understanding for the show's Theon. They chose a really good casting for him.

[lady--croft.livejournal.com]

I was thinking about Roz as well. Why is this girl on so much? Clearly she isn't going away anytime soon. I knew they would have to eliminate and/or merge some of the characters at some point, especially as we progress through the series. I initially thought maybe she could be the new Shae but as more of Roz's character came out she didn't seem, for lack of a better word, 'worthy' of the part. Shae always had an innocence about her. Further, as per previous comments, there is a different actress listed to portray Shae. So then I got to thinking, what about Alayaya? Granted I know she is supposed to be the daughter of the whorehouse's owner but let's face it...they pretty much have Baelish owning the whorehouses now. Alayaya does have a significant albeit minor role in future books and there would be a history established between her and Tyrion already from this season. I could buy Ros as the replacement for Alayaya. Of course by the time next season rolls around I'm certain I'll be proven wrong. At least I don't have to see her and Theon Greyjoy anymore *cringes*

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Alayaya is a possibility, but wasn't she supposed to be dark-skinned? As you say, we will see. But more I think about it , more I come to conclusion that Ros is someone's bright idea of "giving a face" to all the unnamed prostitutes in the story. Whish is odd, because she has nothing to do apart from being naked.

[carnivors.livejournal.com]

yeahh, i understand hbo has a sex quota it needs to fill or whatever, but this particular one was just so unnecessary. and baelish elaborating on his feelings/motivations was not only out of character in telling them to these random girls, but it also reveals A LOT about his character to the viewers at a point when, in the book, i was still in the dark as to pretty much everything having to do with him. i feel like, in the books, we don't really get a handle on littlefinger until the third book, and even then it's a tenuous grip.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Yes, I think it would have worked better if at this pointof time the real intentions of Baelish were unclear. The fact that his backstory is revealed so early might spoil some of the future revelations. ** sigh **

[ishtar79.livejournal.com]

Baelish is quite a revelation in the show. Tyrion is my favourite devious character, but Baelish is a close second.

I don't understand the increased role of Ros. It's not like the show has a lack of hot women without her.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

For me too! In the book he was definitely a hate-hate character to me: I hated him and at the same time had no interest whatsoever (for some reason, I always was more interested in Varys). but in the show? Count me very very interested. But the guy that plays Varys is most awesome too.

[cyberducks.livejournal.com]

Oh, that Littlefinger spilling his guts scene bothered me too. It's totally OOC for him to give another person that much insight into his motives. And the sex was laughably over the top - dear HBO, less is often more....

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

This was probably the scene I had the biggest problem with in all 7 episodes. Seriously, this was pure fanservice.

Same here!

[mookiehyun.livejournal.com]

That spilling beans while too graphic sexing is sooo out of character for Littlefinger, I thought this is one BIG secret he's kept to himself for nearly 2 decades and he's now gutting it all out on a new whore at his establishment?!?!?!?!? VERY WTF for me. I can look away fr all the unnec sex which has been going on every ep for ratings' sake, but this trampled the characterization sooo bad.

haven't read the book, but have been casually watching and now up to date.

I need sth to push me over to OMGness, so far I kinda feel for all the characters, but at the same time I don't think they were fleshed out as vividly as they should, time taken up by all these 'fanservice' scenes.

Re: Same here!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I am really glad that someone who has not read the books is feeling the same too, I was wondering if I felt this way just because I had a certain perception of Littlefinger's character based on the books.

I am pretty obsessed with the show, but I also still don't think it has stepped into greatness yet. I get obsessed with all sorts of things, if you know what I mean. This is a good show (the sets, the costumes, the actors), but it hasn't reached the potential yet. :D She show is getting better as it progresses, but then - bam! Another 5 minute fanservice scene!

Re: Same here!

[mookiehyun.livejournal.com]

Hubs is the one wanting to watch, not knowing a thing and I'm keeping it from him till ep5 that this is an adaptation. He's marveling at the very nice plotting and the abundance of characterization in his fishbowl. This is not sth to be missed on TV these days.

Yes, those interrupting scenes are more jarring as I'm more invested, it does take away fr very nice flow of the narrative! I'm just a bit more bothered by the Littlefinger pouring heart scene coz he intrigued me the most being the most murky and I thought with the most brains. I'm still holding out hope I can forget about this blimp and he goes on and show me more of his conniving smarts.

Re: Same here!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

** nods ** Just wait until it gets to the end of this season! (I am not spoiling ;D)

yes, this is how it was in the books : Littlefinger's intentions and even more, his feelings were very very unclear until much much later (if ever). This was - BIG SPOILERS.