Carnivale: stereotypes of Russians in Western media

[alexandral]

There is something I have encountered few times in the last two weeks. First, in "Sarah Connor Chronicles". As soon as I saw Dimitry-the-Russian-programmer I thought "Aha! He will be the evil character who stole the Turk". And of course, he was the evil character who stole the Turk.

And after "Sarah Connor" I am watching "Carnivale". The Creature of Darkness is revealed as Russian. Oh dear. These things don't bother me too much usually, but when there are too many of them - this can't just be random.

I am thinking really hard and trying to remember an American show where a Russian person wasn't:

1. Evil
2. Programmer (of evil variety)
3. Low intelligence but good at chess
4. Scary mafia guy involved in human traffic

Oh my, look - I am a programmer myself.

To be honest, the stereotypes of Russians are much "softer" than stereotypes of some other nations or religious and sexual orientation minorities.

Comments

[neva-butterfly.livejournal.com]

It's too bad. Most of the Russians we meet here are very nice. One gave us a ride when we got stuck.

Of course sometimes second generation Russians here keep asking me different questions to try to prove I'm Russian.

Like one guy said "How did you get your name if you aren't Russian?" and I said "I'm named after my grandmother." So he said "Oh, she's Russian then." Um, no, her parents just liked the name...

I think there is less stereotyping of Russian women on shows, but yeah, the Russian man tends to be the bad guy unfortunately.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I think there is less stereotyping of Russian women on shows

Hee! This is true! In fact, I remember many complex characters. They are usually portrayed as very beautiful too. :D

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

The Russian thing doesn't bother me at all - it actually amuses the heck out of me (and to be fair, there are just as many stereotypes of Americans in foreign media out there).

I've noticed that in any media, the 'other' are not portrayed with nuance.

Watch Indian movies and all Westerners are either slutty blonde bimboes weak in the knees (or seducing) the pure hero (unless they are blonde angels falling for him) or racist superior pigs.

Watch Asian dramas and black people are thugs or white women are there to swoon over the hero.

That's just how it goes in the media :)

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I agree - this seems to be the phenomena connected with the "other" (nation, religion, etc.).

The Russian thing usually doesn't bother me at all, actually it does, but not because "Oh, I am offended" but because "Oh, this is bad writing" (like lesbiassparrow said).

But the sad truth is, these stereotypes do affect people's perceptions and prejudices.

[revolos55.livejournal.com]

The mom in Six Feet Under dated a Russian guy for a while. He was ok.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Thank you so much!!!!! I knew there must be some somewhere. :D

[linfer.livejournal.com]

He wasn't just okay, he was awesome! :o)

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

SOunds great. :D

[lesbiassparrow.livejournal.com]

It's such lazy writing; it's as if the writers are aware that they need a baddie but know they're not supposed to portray certain groups as automatically evil so they go for some group that won't complain but they don't need to write any nuances for. Of course, they then still do the same with other minorities, but then can point to the fact that they had a 'white' villain too.

Plus it makes it terribly easy to spot the baddie: you know as soon as you hear an Eastern European or Middle Eastern accent that they will be a wrong 'un.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I agree with everything that you saying, I think the point about "a white villain" is spot-on.

Plus it makes it terribly easy to spot the baddie: you know as soon as you hear an Eastern European or Middle Eastern accent that they will be a wrong 'un.

This is so true.

[mnemo-syne.livejournal.com]

Dude I know, Russians are always evil in Western entertainment! Could the Cold War have held over that long? Maybe they/'we' just find a Russian accent intimidating. ;) Sorry, though.

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

There are always lots of evil English people too! Whatever happened to the Special Relationship? :P

[revolos55.livejournal.com]

It might be a Cold War holdover. I know it's kinda programmed in at a societal level when learning history, that "during this time period we we're the good guys, and these were the bad guys". In chronological order, the English, the Germans, the Japanese, the Russians/Soviet Union, and the Middle Easterners.

I found my reaction to a recent Doctor Who episode intersting, because even though I have no experience with WWII or Nazis, Daleks speaking German was ten times scarier than Daleks speaking English. It's an "Allied culture" response.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Hee! I think it is a post cold-war thing, but as some other commenter pointed out - it is difficult for me to think of another distinctly not-USA-American nation that is portrayed well in the media. :D

[the-reverand.livejournal.com]

You're completely right! The bad guys in the recent X-Files movie? Russians. Americans love Russian bad guys. I especially like Russian bad guys when the wear the fuzzy hats!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Tell me about BIG FUZZY HATS!! To tell the truth, people wear them a lot in RUssia. :D

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

Actually, I don't think Dmitri was portrayed as evil, so much as weak and in a very tight spot - he owed the (Russian, OK! I give you this one!) gangsters money for helping his sister come over to the US (and she was very nice and very sweet!) and he had no idea what the Turk actually was.

So I didn't read him as "evil" - just sort of hapless. The gangsters who murdered him, were, of course evil (although Cameron had also pissed them off by beating on the guy sent to threaten the sister so maybe they were extra-violent at that point.)

The true evil in that episode, IMO, is actually Cameron. (Or, I guess since she's a robot and she has no ethics, she is at best amoral, but nothing Dmitri does is as bad as what Cameron does - or what Derek does, because after all, he murdered Andy.)

Rest assured, however, that it is not only Russians who suffer from this stereotyping, as of course, all Italian-Americans are involved with the Mafia on American tv.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Rest assured, however, that it is not only Russians who suffer from this stereotyping, as of course, all Italian-Americans are involved with the Mafia on American tv

True. It is so hard for me to think of a nation (other than USA-American) that is portrayed very favourably in the American TV.

[pansy-burke.livejournal.com]

Red Heat (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095963/) and Gorky Park (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085615/) come to mind as examples for positive russian characters (which had to prove themselves first). Both film from the 80ies, from the high times of the cold war.

But I can't think of more than those two.

And to be honest, I have some very bad stereotypes of russians myself, coming from the two times I was in Petersburg and Moscow. But I try to get over then, I honestly do.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

And to be honest, I have some very bad stereotypes of russians myself, coming from the two times I was in Petersburg and Moscow. But I try to get over then, I honestly do.

Sadly, I understand what you men. I know that some of the things I also experienced during our last Moscow visit can be explained by the hardness of life there, but still.

[dianora77.livejournal.com]

One of the most prominent and best Croatian actors (Rade Serbedzija) claims he has made a career for himself in Hollywood and yet is always typecast as East-European/Russian mafiosos. I think that after staring in beautiful, poetic movies, and being one of the best Shakespearean actors in this area, that's a bit of a reversal. But yeah, I suppose the guy's gotta feed his family, too... And actors salaries in our country are laughable indeed. Unless you're acting in soaps. If you can call that horror "acting". :P

P.S. I'm sorry, I totally forgot about that aspect of Carnivale. I suppose it simply didn't register with me. :/

[dianora77.livejournal.com]

Mafioso. Not mafiosos... (That's what happens when you change a part of your sentence without checking the rest of it. :P)

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I don't think USA media is particular kind to any foreigners. :D

P.S. I'm sorry, I totally forgot about that aspect of Carnivale. I suppose it simply didn't register with me. :/

Hee! Actually I much prefer brother Justine to the good-character buy guy. He is AWESOME.

[arathisiewen.livejournal.com]

I knew a very adorable, red headed Russian boy in high school... not an evil mastermind to my knowledge, but I COULD see him becomming a programmer. We have a couple Eastern European customers at the coffee shop as of late, too... also not villains to my knowledge. But possibly engineers.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Heeeeeee!

[teh-haley.livejournal.com]

Rocky IV? Not that flattering, though :\

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Ture. :D On both accounts. ;D