What do you think about spoilers (in general)?

[alexandral]

There is a bit of excitement going on in ASOIF fandom as the first (unconfirmed!) spoilers for "A Dance with Dragons" are released. Apparently, some Amazon orders were dispatched in Germany, or something like this. If this is true.

I have read some spoilers (I sworn to not disclose where :D) , but they are , of course, unconfirmed and MIGHT NOT BE TRUE. And regardless, I will not tell them to anyone because it seems that I am such a minority in the fandom as far as spoilers are concerned. As in: I love spoilers, the rest of the world hates them.

Me? Reading Russian literature, I grew up with the idea that stories have bad endings more often than they have good ones. So I discovered by experience that for me the best way to deal with a bad ending is to know it in advance, before I get too emotionally involved. The last time I read something unspoiled was "Little mermaid" at the age of 7, and after reading the ending I said to myself "The fairytales have bad endings too, I must check the endings from now on". So I did, always reading the last pages of the book first.

When I joined the fandom and found out that not everyone reads the last pages first, I was surprised. How do you deal with the death of your favourite characters? Or with the ships that gone astray?

But all I wanted to say, really - I WILL NOT SPOIL YOU!!! HONESTLY. I will post pictures of Nicolaj Coster-Waldau and other unspoilery things. And this post is just to discuss how you feel about spoilers and why.



PS: But I went and pre-ordered my copy of the book on Amazon. What if their software has a glitch again and my copy is dispatched?

Comments

[liamtheruiner.livejournal.com]

there are four elements to a story: setting, theme, character, and narrative. plot is part of narrative, but a consequence of all four. spoilers, though, are strictly the most abstract descriptions of the most basic parts of the plot, and generally do not take away anything from the four elements of the story. unless a story's narrative style relies heavily on plot twists, a spoiler really isn't going to be a bad thing, and only the most ignorant pricks who can't appreciate a story beyond that get upset. that said, grrm does rely on the occasional plot twist, so...

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I do usually read the biggest spoliers only, and it never actually "spoils" anything, because - everything is in the journey. :D

But you know, sometimes the ending is such that I put the book down, because I don't like the story. This happened before, but not often.

In GRRM's case, I think I have found the logic in his madness already - no-one is safe. :D

[dekyria.livejournal.com]

I read spoilers (and last pages of a book) and I think it's damn annoying.. If I know what's going on I don't feel like reading the book anymore. Annoying habit :p I'm still at page 330 of ASOS :( IDK what to do. Freaking out atm :p And now that some books have been sent I'm freaking out even more. Will never finish these damn books.

Minor spoiler: GRRM said more POV chars will die (though not necessarily in ADWD) and IDK if I could read on if Jon or Sansa died or something. I might just throw the book out of the window :p And yeah ships.. I'm used to it, when I love a ship, and then for some reason they can't be together for a long period of time or something.. Used to that unfortunately =/

My feelings about spoilers are so mixed, IDEK! :p

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I am different - if anything, I get really nervious when I don't know the spoilers (TV shows, mostly), and it drives me mad , in a bad way: tired, upset.

But if I know how a book ends, I just enjoy the journey.

Also, I tend to predict the endings with high accuracy, so i only spoil myself when I can't.

Minor spoiler: GRRM said more POV chars will die

This is a given. :D But please, no more spoilers here - I promised. :D

[gingaktb.livejournal.com]

Spoilers generally don't bother me except for a few series. It's really all depends on if I feel like trudging through or not. Though in this case, I'd hate to be spoiler because I've been waiting for this book. XD

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I respect your preferences - I will not say anything (the spoilers might not be even true).

long comment, sorry!

[intermezzo]

I don't like spoilers. Can't say I hate them, but I certainly don't love them. I noticed that the more I know about what might happen in a show/movie/novel I want to watch/read, the less I actually want to go ahead and watch/read it. It's like I automatically lose interest in it. Hell, I don't even like spoilers in kdramas even if it's perfectly clear what is going to happen and despite the fact that I'm more interested in the way the character evolve rather than the plot itself. I just don't want to know. It's like spoiling a suprise?

For me, half the fun of watching a show or reading a novel is anticipating what's going to happen and the exhilaration of finally getting to know what was the big surprise. Sure, there are times when the surprise is negative, but that's sort of like life, you know what I mean?

As a general rule of thumb, I always, always get attached to characters so whether I know what's going to happen to them or not is not going to change how I'll feel about it. Ie a character death is a character death and chances are I'll cry whether I know if it's going to happen or not. If anything, spoilers just put the event out of context and that belittles the event itself (IMHO, It takes away from the emotional impact it would have had if it had been in context) and also triggers a chain of events that might make me NOT want to read/watch whatever it is I'm reading/watching. That said, if a major character death were to happen, I'd like to know. Just in general terms. Like, say, if Mu-gyul had died in ep 15 of M3, I would have liked that someone had told me beforehand something along the lines of "Oh dude, something is going to happen to Mu-gyul-ah! Watch out and bring out your tissues!"

To answer your question, I don't get over it, if that's what you mean. With time, the shock or the sadness fade away eventually just like it does when something happens IRL.

Btw, I might get very very very very vocal if someone posts spoilers, big or tiny, without warning first or not under a cut. Because that shows little respect for the people who do not like spoilers. Actually, let me rephrase that: that shows little respect, period. I treat my journal and my flist in exactly the same way I'd like to be treated. With consideration. That's why I put entries that might trigger people under a cut, which is why I expect other people to show the same respect. I know we're talking spoilers here, but I'd like to extend this to any entries that contain sensitive topics. It's NOT fun when you're reading your flist, in a place you consider "safe", a place where you go to have fun and instead you get triggered and spend half a day recovering from the joys of panic attacks and whatnot.

I know it seems harsh, but I have purposely not added people to my flist, even if I do like them, because they're known to post huge spoilery entries and/or sensitive topics without a cut. You could argue that it's their journal and that they're entitled to post whatever they want. Fine, fair enough. But it's my prerogative to protect myself and if giving up a potential friend is it, so be it. And I'm apparently I'm an ignorant jerk. Ah well.

Way to go ranty and OT, Self!

Re: long comment, sorry!

[intermezzo]

Right, so I think I sound mean in the last portion of my comment and that wasn't my intention. JSYK, I wasn't accusing you. I was talking in general. It's just...I've been burned many times before. If it's spoilers, it simply ruins my fun and I can get over it. But I've been triggered before and that doesn't fly well with me because it's already hard as it is without the extra drama, you know? I mean, using a cut takes 5 seconds of your (again, general you, not youyou) life but it can save a lot of grief to a reader, who WILL be eternally grateful if they can still enjoy Net-life and avoid triggers. Know what I mean?

[ginger001]

Give me spoilers anytime! I don't mind them, in fact I look for them, so no worries about me... I find Nicolaj Coster-Waldau extremely handsome, so keep bringing the pretty ;)

You are not along in LJ about the spoilers as you can see ;)

Was your birthday around these days or am I confused? If it has been already, I apologize and wish you belated Happy Birthday!!! And if it's close, Happy Birthday and hope you have a great day!!! ^^

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

YAY! I knew there must be some folks like me. :D

YEs, my birthday was recently - thank you so so much for the birthday wishes!!!!!!!!!

[geeklee.livejournal.com]

well, as i was begging you for the link before i found it, i think its safe to say i don't mind spoilers.

and for some reason, this series makes me want to seek out spoilers more than ever! i just have to know what happens next.

but yes, most people hate them. in fact, a friend of mine is very angry for me for discussing something that happened in the series but he missed. he says i still shouldn't have said anything, as if i could be aware of when he was paying attention or not.

i don't like spoilers with movies though. somehow, that's different :)

i've already ordered my book as well. and i love that gif of sansan.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I am so sorry I missed your message - I went to bed already. I am glad you found them!

I am the same with ASOIF. With some books or shows where I feel that everything is going to end well anyways, I don't even bother looking for spoilers. But something like ASOIF where everyone is going to die - I need my spoilers!

i don't like spoilers with movies though. somehow, that's different :)

We are kindred spirits!! I am the same - I think beause the movies are so short in comparison with books or TV shows, i can usually contain myself and watch them without being spoiled, but I do not hide from film spoilers. I never hide from spoilers.

I am glad you like the gif - it is totally shareable!

[verdande-mi.livejournal.com]

I don’t have the books and have yet to read them. I actually hadn’t heard of the books until I stumbled across a Game of thrones trailer some time before it started airing. I was drawn in by the fantasy element and Sean Bean, and decided to give it a go (not regretting that at all).

I am obviously spoiled regarding the first book since I’ve seen the whole first series, but I don’t actively stay away from spoilers regarding the books, though that might change when I actually start reading. I will, I think stay away from spoilers for the second series. I used to be much more spoiler-friendly than I am these days, but I have come to realize that I enjoy the wonder and joy of reading/watching something with no idea of what twist and turns are coming ahead. I hope I will be able to read through the first two books before the new series starts airing, but if for some reason I don’t, I probably won’t hold off on watching the new series. Hopefully the books will hook me in just as fast as the series did and keep me reading at a fast phase even after school starts up again in the fall.

A big part of why I stay away from spoilers is because the spoiler is only a small hint or glimpse of something and it is taken out of the context it belongs to and some portions of some fandoms at least have a tendency to very vocally address why they don’t want this and that with much negativity and drama, and I just don’t want any of that to spoil my fun. I also don’t want myself to spoil the fun; it’s so easy with a spoiler, especially if I don’t particularly care for it, to speculate and spin it out of proportions and make it bigger and worse than it really is.

In short in any part of fanon and canon I want to enjoy and bask in all the good things and hurriedly brush of (and keep out of mind as much as I can without ruining the continued canon) the things that I don’t really like.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I was hugely obsessed with the books 6 years ago, and for me it is the icing on the cake to watch the TV show made from one of my favourite book series.

A big part of why I stay away from spoilers is because the spoiler is only a small hint or glimpse of something and it is taken out of the context it belongs to and some portions of some fandoms at least have a tendency to very vocally address why they don’t want this and that with much negativity and drama, and I just don’t want any of that to spoil my fun.

This is a very good point. Over the years, I have developed a skill of spoiler-gathering and usually I just look for the main spoilers (deaths, marriages, this kind of thing, mostly deaths). Because some things taken out of the context do not make sense at all. I remember all the Battlestar Galactica spoilers - they were very confusing.

Also, yes, I tend to stay away from the drama. I do occasionally rant in this LJ , but my rants are not to be taken seriously. I am not usually bitter about anything. Well, I am still bitter about the Little mermaid ending, but this is it.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I half-follow spoilers for things I'm not reading/watching or think I might read/watch in the distant future, but avoid them for thingS i actually am reading/watching. Sometimes, like in city Hunter, a spoiler causes something to shoot to the top of my list.

The only time I look at/ask for spoilers for something I am reading/watching is as an early warning system, such as how i only made it through season 2 of Vampire Diaries by being forwarned about Damon's latest way to wallow in misogyny, even if I was utilizing the FF butt a lot.

I'm not really worried about people dying or couples getting together, in terms of foreknowledge, unless it's something that will make me mad, and that's usually fridging or women ending up with men who treat them like garbage.

I like seeing the journey play out as much as I like getting to the end, even if most stories do follow a limited number of narrative paths.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I'm not really worried about people dying or couples getting together, in terms of foreknowledge, unless it's something that will make me mad, and that's usually fridging or women ending up with men who treat them like garbage.

I am the same. With several (not many, but few) shows or books I like to be spoiled because I want to know if I should start the journey, or not, if the end destination is worthy of the effort. Some Korean shows are like that for me -, for example , there is no way I am going to watch 49 days.

[lesbiassparrow.livejournal.com]

I always read the end of a book first. As you said - what if someone dies? Or turns out to be evil? It's never ruined my enjoyment (same for any spoilers, really). Maybe it's being in the Classics; you know how most stories are going to end - it's the getting there that's fun.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Yes, I think this is THE CALSSICS. Or old-days Russian literature that does it to us. usually you already know the ending anyways, andif you don't - you are better off knowing. There is too much tragedy!

[lightsjustright.livejournal.com]

I think it depends a lot on the genre for me. I can deal with spoilers about, say, who ends up with who in a romance (actually, I want to be certain on this, LOL) but if I'm watching something like a thriller/mystery/horror film the suspense in not knowing is a huge part of the experience for me. But especially with stuff like asian dramas, which are so character driven, I think the smaller moments ultimately matter more to me than knowing how it ends.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I quite enjoy watching movies uspoiled. I guess for me, it is because the movie is so short? So I don't invest hours and hours of my time into something that might not end the way I like it?

I usually can tell with the pairings, though. I have laughed about it with my friends before, but I seem to always choose the canon pairings. The only non-canon pairing I was fond of was the one in "Little women" (and I heard that the author intended to finish the book differently at first and changed her mind).

But with deths? I wanna know all unexpected deths. With someone like martin, I better find out.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I always read the end of a book first and find spoilers for dramas, tv shows etc. It has yet to ruin anything for me - if I know the outcome I can relax and enjoy the journey. Saying spoilers ruin it for you is like complaining you can never watch an adaptation of a novel because hey, you read the novel and know what happens. Nobody ever says that.

As the wonderful Victorian novelist Anthony Trollope put it (I am paraphrasing), there is no point in surprise which anyone can find out simply by peeking at the end.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

The same for me. And as you know, I do get relly REALLY worried if I don't know the ending. Like Chuno, where the worry has almost thrown me over the edge.

but as you also know, I do tend to have good predictions record. But NOT with Martin. He is twistly.

This is a good point!!!

[lage-nom-ai.livejournal.com]

If it's a tv show/book I'll never actually watch/read, then of course I don't mind spoilers. Sometimes I totally want them because I want to know what everyone else will be freaking out about.

But with shows that I'm into? I haaaaaaaaaate spoilers. It ruins a lot of the pleasure of the show's on pacing, tensions, climaxes, etc, if I know what's going to happen. Like blueocean up above, I've not added anyone I've come across from GOT/ASOFAI fandom because I'm still irked at spoilers that have slipped through, no matter how unintentional or seemingly minor. I don't want to know anything about not only who dies, but also who ends up in a relationship with whom, whose character changes, etc. I want the fun of that unfolding for me as the show does.

I also cannot fathom reading the ending of a novel first. Again, for me, that totally ruins a lot of the actual story. I love the pleasure of pitting myself against the author/narrator, to see when I predict things, and if they're right. Or when I totally don't see some twist coming, I love that feeling of having all of my expectations upended. Reading the end or getting spoilers ruins the depth of engagement with the text (or show) for me.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

When you succeeded in not-spoiling yourself for the ending of the first season of GoT - I thought you were so awesome!

I have developed some skill in spoiler-gathering, though. I am usually interested in character deaths, but at the same time I like to keep unspoiled for plot developments (but i am not to worried when accidents happen). Like, for example, when i was reading GoT I quickly found out that Ned is going to die (by Googling), but I was also unspoiled for the dragon part, which felt fabulous.


BTW, I am marking my GoT posts with Spoiler warnings - I want everyone to feel safe!

[cyberducks.livejournal.com]

I just spoiled myself silly over at TWoP about the new book - there is no way I am going to read this book spoilerfree - not when I am so worried about the fates of my favorite characters.

I also often read the endings of novels first - don't want to be unaware of a possible bad or sad ending.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

yessss! There are quite few readers like me!!! I like the romance novels, though - you never even need to check the ending., you always know what is going to happen.

[kem-viva.livejournal.com]

Im not a huge spoiler fan, but can you just tell me one thing if you happen to have knowledge of it:

Is Jaime alive at the end of ADWD? (yes i really need to know xD)

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I am sending you a message!!!

[failte-aoife.livejournal.com]

Yes it is true...a friend of mine got her copy yesterday and I am not jelous at all. Really.

I try to avoid big spoilers (who dies and stuff), but am OK with smaller ones (I read an early review of Dance, where we were told stuff about Jon and Tyrion, I assume that these things happen quite early in the book anyway, so no problem for me).
But e.g. in I got spoilered about the Red Wedding in ASOS and that just took away the shock-value of that event completely and I just felt indifferent when I read it. I knew what was comming so I was just waiting for it all the time, and when it happened I was just 'OK, now it's over'.

In another series (not George Martin) I got spoilered that my favourite character would die in book four, so I refused to read the book for quite some time. Though when I got there that death still had quite a lot of impact on me...I think I just couldn't enjoy the beginning of the book anymore, there were quite a lot of nice and funny scenes but I was already depressed all the time XD

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I AM SO JEALOUS. And thank you so much for confirming - I was worrying this is just a hoax.

I like to be spoiled for deaths, but to stay unspoiled for plot developments. Like with ASAS, I was spoiled for the Red Wedding,(which still shocked me out of my comfort zone for weeks). but all the plot around Tyrion - I read it aunspoiled and it was fun (I knew he is going to be alive , though :D).

I am like that with The Wire, one of my most beloved series. i know my favourite character is going to die in the season 5, so I have never attempted to watch the season. May be one day.

[linfer.livejournal.com]

A friend of mine got her copy yesterday. She was very happy about it. :o)

I feel kind of cheated when I stumble over a spoiler, because I want to be suprisded about what happens, even if it's super sad and leaves me devasted for some time.
It's only when I don't care about something that I read spoilers.
So it seems I'm the complete opposite. ;)

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Are you going to ask her for spoilers? ** wink wink **?

I am different - when i don't care too much, I can contain myself. But when i do, I have to know. Like with Chuno, not knowing the spoilers almost killed me (even though I knew in my heart how the series is going to end).

Yes, it seems!

[cyberducks.livejournal.com]

I see it was your birthday last week - happy belated birthday and many happy returns!

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Thank you so much!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dianora77.livejournal.com]

I had to sign a confidentiality clause, so you won't be getting any spoilers from me. :P

[baleanoptera.livejournal.com]

I've mentioned that I'm incredibly jealous of you, right? ;)

Though I hope that come July 12th you'll be able to post a bit. *g*

[baleanoptera.livejournal.com]

I love spoilers, so you're not the only one. I find that knowing a bit about what is going to happen actually increases my enjoyment of a story - and it also lets me mentally prepare for unpleasant twists and turns. I know, some people like unexpected twists, but I just don't. In that regard spoilers are beautiful things. ;)

And thanks to you I've tried to dig up all the DwD spoilers I could find. Hee.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I like the twists, up to a point. I usually just spoil myself for deathsm,, but try to avoid the major plot developments.But I am not too worried if I do get spoiled for the plot developments.

I am tempted to make a filtered post and discuss the spoilers- what do you think of this idea?

[viennajones.livejournal.com]

I LOVE SPOILERS :D You are not alone. Or, well. Love is probably to strong, but I don't mind, and they do not actually spoil anything for me, so.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

For me too. Sometimes, I do not read the book after I found out the spoilers, bbut I never regret - Iwould have hated the ending anyways.

[shapinglight]

I think I found being such a big Spike fan in the BtVS so traumatic that I've successfully managed to avoid getting as emotionally involved with a fictional character ever again. Therefore, I don't like spoilers any more, but like to be surprised. Back when BtVS was on air, I had to be spoilered, because I couldn't take any more shocks to the system such as I received during season 6 of that show. Bit pathetic, but there it is.

That said, I've felt myself slipping since discovering Dany/Jorah. I got accidentally slighly spoilered and am relieved I now know the worst (so far, since the series isn't over, and I know it could still get worse).So for me, as it is for you, I only want to be spoilered when I'm very emotionally engaged. If I manage to keep a distance, I would much rather be spoiler free.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I was such a fan of Spike too! I arrived late to the BtVS fandom , after the show has finished already, but I also liked Buffy with Spike (I liked Angel with Cordelia, as well).

[timescout.livejournal.com]

Late to the party, heh. I don't mind spoilers if it's a question of romantic fluff or something else 'lightweight'. If the drama/show is a about revenge/something really plotty etc I'd rather not be spoiled as it does tend to flatten the impact e.g a true heart twrenching ending would otherwise have. Yeah, I'm a masochist. ;P That said I've been known to hunt for spoilers for some of the more meatier stuff out there as well. I've become quite good a picking out the stories I definitely don't want to be spoiled for so I know to stear clear.

Oh, I sometimes read the endings of books too and I've dropped books when I didn't like how they end.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

I think I am less concerned with the romantic endings, it is the deaths I definitely prefer to be spoiled for. And I think I am getting softer with the years (I definitely do not like people dying in my TV shows), or may be it is becoming easier to find spoilers.

but yes, I have also become quite good at filtering things that I don't want to be spoiled for (like main plot developments)..

The stories that I don't like to be spoiled for are whodunits. When everything is in the ending and there isn't really too much chance of your main character dying (because they are the police :D). Like, Danish show The Killing - I wasn't even tempted to check the ending, I enjoyed the guessing game and the twists so much.

[nymeri.livejournal.com]

I stay as far away from spoilers as I can. I want the thrill of the surprise, the first time I read something. I want to be shocked. I want to become emotionally invested in characters, even if they die, because that often makes me love them so much more. That also makes it more interesting to reread something, since I can do it with a completely new perspective.

[alexandral.livejournal.com]

Once read, I rarely re-read. The only book I re-read few times is Dostoyevsky's "Idiot". And I am re-reading some parts of ASOIF now as I have forgotten some details.